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Post by Hattrick on Nov 26, 2014 9:46:38 GMT -6
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Post by Steven Gerrard on Nov 26, 2014 10:31:33 GMT -6
If times runs out, time runs out. You do not add time for a corner kick. This is why late in the game the team losing typically runs to get the ball and takes the corner kick as quickly as possible.
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Post by time2retire on Nov 26, 2014 15:34:27 GMT -6
The referee made no secret of how much time remained. When Terrebonne's striker was shown the yellow card, he quite loudly and clearly announced 1:37 remaining...I definitely heard him. When Terrebonne was leading late and began to sub, the referee gave the signal for stopping the clock and was pretty clear he had the time. The ball went out for the EDW corner kick with :04 remaining. By the time the ball was placed in the corner, time had expired and the whistle blew, correctly, to end the game.
How much of an "expert take" are you looking for?
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p_malinich
Data Expert 
www.elevenlions.com
Posts: 4,201
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Post by p_malinich on Nov 26, 2014 18:41:26 GMT -6
Until time2retire answered with very specific details, I would've probably commented on the fuzziness of stoppage time & that it's well within the referee's authority to do exactly what he did. It just depends whether you were on attack or defending as to whether you like the timing of the whistle.
The NCAA as well as high schools in PA (to where we've recently moved) actually take the end of the game away from the officials. Stoppage time doesn't exist. There's a clock that counts down to a buzzer and when the buzzer sounds, the game is over. That said, the center can choose to stop the clock on late in the game excessive delays by opponent, dead ball, etc. The clock also stops for goals and generally any prolonged injury.
It's probably one of the few (if not the only) adjustments to the game that I actually appreciate. No more guessing in the stands. No more situations like Klinsmann asking only 1 more minute. Fans, parents, and players are well aware of the exact moment of the end of the game.
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Post by happyjack on Nov 26, 2014 19:49:34 GMT -6
My take is that it is correct, you add time for a penalty kick to be taken, there is nothing in the laws of the game that says you can't stop time because a corner kick was awarded. Common misconception that you can't stop the game "if an attack is on".
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Post by Sanofi-Aventis on Nov 26, 2014 20:18:28 GMT -6
When Terrebonne's striker was shown the yellow card, he quite loudly and clearly announced 1:37 remaining...I definitely heard him. When Terrebonne was leading late and began to sub, the referee gave the signal for stopping the clock and was pretty clear he had the time. 1:37??? I've never heard a referee ever proclaim clearly or unclearly, loudly or softly a time as exact as that. Interesting... |
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Post by time2retire on Nov 26, 2014 21:56:28 GMT -6
When Terrebonne's striker was shown the yellow card, he quite loudly and clearly announced 1:37 remaining...I definitely heard him. When Terrebonne was leading late and began to sub, the referee gave the signal for stopping the clock and was pretty clear he had the time. 1:37??? I've never heard a referee ever proclaim clearly or unclearly, loudly or softly a time as exact as that. Interesting... The referee for this game recognized the need to announce time remaining for this exact purpose...for the time to be precisely known to relevant parties. The clock should never be a secret, whether official on the clock or the field. With the clock stopped at 2:00 (incorrectly) he had the obligation to the game to announce time remaining. The players deserved that. And he, as the area referee instructor, must set the example for others to follow. Including having the cohones to blow the whistle when time expires. |
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Post by soccerdad23 on Nov 26, 2014 22:31:32 GMT -6
That must have been a VERY interesting game to be at!!
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Post by time2retire on Nov 27, 2014 1:03:39 GMT -6
That must have been a VERY interesting game to be at! Not particularly. One foul at midfield was marginal, otherwise, solid as expected. |
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boca
Bench Warmer
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Post by boca on Nov 29, 2014 15:14:56 GMT -6
I have one better on this guy. He told players in this game who attempted to get on the ball when an opposing team was awarded a free kick, "Don't even try it!" Really, when did refs start requesting 10 yards on a free kick for the attacking team, it's the attacking players task to request the 10 yards. I agree this warning may have been appropriate if the defending player refused to move away from the ball placed for a free kick, but this was not the case. This would then constitute a delay, but not before then.
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Post by picard on Nov 29, 2014 15:15:01 GMT -6
The referee made no secret of how much time remained. When Terrebonne's striker was shown the yellow card, he quite loudly and clearly announced 1:37 remaining...I definitely heard him. When Terrebonne was leading late and began to sub, the referee gave the signal for stopping the clock and was pretty clear he had the time. The ball went out for the EDW corner kick with :04 remaining. By the time the ball was placed in the corner, time had expired and the whistle blew, correctly, to end the game. How much of an "expert take" are you looking for? With details such as this, sounds as if 'you' were the referee in this game. Figures, go back to Maryland or where ever you're from. Uncalled for. Our referees deserve respect. There are far too many who quit because of the snide remarks that are unwarranted. |
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p_malinich
Data Expert
www.elevenlions.com
Posts: 4,201
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Post by p_malinich on Nov 29, 2014 16:44:39 GMT -6
I have one better on this guy. He told players in this game who attempted to get on the ball when an opposing team was awarded a free kick, "Don't even try it!" Really, when did refs start requesting 10 yards on a free kick for the attacking team, it's the attacking players task to request the 10 yards. I agree this warning may have been appropriate if the defending player refused to move away from the ball placed for a free kick, but this was not the case. This would then constitute a delay, but not before then. I think that's a common misunderstanding in the High School game. Go to the NFHS Handbook on page 64, rule 13, article 3. It says that defending players must be at least 10 yards away (unless it puts them over the end line). The person taking the free kick doesn't have to ask for it (although they often asked for it to be marked off, but then they need to wait for a whistle to restart). In the past I've seen guys jump in front of the ball to prevent a quick restart & been carded for doing so (which I think does follow the NFHS guidelines). In club it is much more tolerated (but not sure if it's a different rule or not). It sounds like that ref was trying to protect the defending players from getting a foolish yellow card (in the NFHS world). |
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Post by soccerdad23 on Nov 29, 2014 17:26:53 GMT -6
I say again...that must have been a VERY!! interesting game to be at :-)
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Post by time2retire on Nov 29, 2014 18:34:53 GMT -6
The referee made no secret of how much time remained. When Terrebonne's striker was shown the yellow card, he quite loudly and clearly announced 1:37 remaining...I definitely heard him. When Terrebonne was leading late and began to sub, the referee gave the signal for stopping the clock and was pretty clear he had the time. The ball went out for the EDW corner kick with :04 remaining. By the time the ball was placed in the corner, time had expired and the whistle blew, correctly, to end the game. How much of an "expert take" are you looking for? With details such as this, sounds as if 'you' were the referee in this game. Figures, go back to Maryland or where ever you're from. She asked for details and the "expert take", and got that information from more than one person involved in referee instruction. Yet you felt the need to set aside those answers and information and volley insults...interesting...should veterans not be allowed to return home? |
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Post by time2retire on Nov 29, 2014 18:39:48 GMT -6
I have one better on this guy. He told players in this game who attempted to get on the ball when an opposing team was awarded a free kick, "Don't even try it!" Really, when did refs start requesting 10 yards on a free kick for the attacking team, it's the attacking players task to request the 10 yards. I agree this warning may have been appropriate if the defending player refused to move away from the ball placed for a free kick, but this was not the case. This would then constitute a delay, but not before then. Ceremonial vs quick restarts, and their courses of action from the referee perspective. But I'm sure you knew that already... If you're here to learn or get more factual information, I am obligated to help you out. I'll discuss anything with anyone if you're willing to hear what happened, why I chose the action I did, or anything else. I don't mind taking that moment out of my time if it helps you better understand why things happen the way they do, in any game that I do...club, hs, college, amateur, or whatever else. You have a video of this game, or any other I worked? Find the clips you want to discuss, we'll arrange a time and place and go over it. Things look different from the angle you had, and if I'm wrong, I have no problem owning up to it. You will not find any other referee who would be willing to do this with random people. Some in your crowd already have. Your coach can scratch any referee that he wants and the referee assignor will honor the scratch, but...careful what you wish for. |
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Post by time2retire on Nov 29, 2014 18:43:12 GMT -6
With details such as this, sounds as if 'you' were the referee in this game. Figures, go back to Maryland or where ever you're from. Uncalled for. Our referees deserve respect. There are far too many who quit because of the snide remarks that are unwarranted. I've been called much worse, by much better, in much more serious games. |
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Post by happyjack on Nov 29, 2014 19:30:23 GMT -6
I have one better on this guy. He told players in this game who attempted to get on the ball when an opposing team was awarded a free kick, "Don't even try it!" Really, when did refs start requesting 10 yards on a free kick for the attacking team, it's the attacking players task to request the 10 yards. I agree this warning may have been appropriate if the defending player refused to move away from the ball placed for a free kick, but this was not the case. This would then constitute a delay, but not before then. Well, since the law REQUIRES players to retreat 10 yards, what the referee is doing is called taking preventive action, something that USSF and LSA are working to implement across all levels and getting referees to accept and get comfortable doing. Some are good at it and it is recognizable when they do it - sounds like this is the case here. I'm an instructor, this is covered heavily in law 5 referees powers and duties when I teach a class. A word now to a player about something like this stops the player from aN action that could result in a card. Why wouldn't we want officials to do this? It has been at least 5 years since USSF changed this, at least 4 for high school, and yet there is still this myth among players and spectators that the offense must ask. |
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Post by laffysoccermom on Nov 29, 2014 19:38:15 GMT -6
In club- they do not have to necessarily ask either? Is that correct? I am so tired of hearing our parents try to correct the ref if he moves our players without the other team asking. I just want to verify this for once and all.
BTW, I finally convinced a few of our parents that the definition of offside is when the AR raises the flag. It's great to hear- no she wasn't offside- the flag didn't go up.
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Post by happyjack on Nov 29, 2014 19:51:48 GMT -6
They are required to move back 10 yards...nothing says they have to move fast...a player can ask for 10 and that gets a ceremonial restart (referee sets wall and kick requires whistle). Preventively, referee can hold up hand to stop players encroaching and tell them move back.
As far as offside, it occurs when a player is in the attacking half, closer to the goal line than the ball or the 2nd to the last defender. Now, just because someone is in that position doesn't mean you will penalize. the referee blows the whistle to stop play because the attacker has gained an advantage by being in an offside position, become actively involved in play, or interfered with an opponent. A player can be in an offside position all game and never penalized if one of those 3 scenarios don't occur. The AR signals to indicate in his opinion one of the 3 was met, the referee can choose to accept and act on this -signaling by whistle to stop play - or overrule the AR and allow play to continue. Also, if the ball has gone to a defender and moved past the point of where the infraction was, referee may choose to allow play to continue.
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Post by laffysoccermom on Nov 30, 2014 3:54:21 GMT -6
The offside thing was a joke. I got tired of a few parents arguing about offside so I told them that and they believed me. It saves them from arguing with the ref because it basically means a player is offside when the ref says so. Ultimately that's what matters anyway.
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