nolab
Bench Warmer
Posts: 4
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Throw Ins
Jan 12, 2019 17:13:14 GMT -6
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Post by nolab on Jan 12, 2019 17:13:14 GMT -6
U-High has shown to be the better team so far. U-high is holding position at approximately a 60/49 split. Goal St. Louis off a throw in from the 18. The throws appear to be illegal but I’m allowing the refs to call the game. What was illegal about the throw ins?
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Throw Ins
Jan 12, 2019 17:32:29 GMT -6
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Post by time2retire on Jan 12, 2019 17:32:29 GMT -6
U-High has shown to be the better team so far. U-high is holding position at approximately a 60/49 split. Goal St. Louis off a throw in from the 18. The throws appear to be illegal but I’m allowing the refs to call the game. What was illegal about the throw ins? They were lobbed over the wall into the promised land of 1-on-1 with the keeper. A yuuuuge throw.
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Post by AgSurfer on Jan 12, 2019 18:36:05 GMT -6
U-High has shown to be the better team so far. U-high is holding position at approximately a 60/49 split. Goal St. Louis off a throw in from the 18. The throws appear to be illegal but I’m allowing the refs to call the game. What was illegal about the throw ins? Not at this game, but the newish rule allowing for the ball to be brought behind the head from the side, then over the top of the head as in the past is being abused. Too many long ball throw-ins are never brought over the top of the head before release. Instead, they stay on the side of the head it was brought back on and a form of a baseball throw is performed. It happens in club as well as in high school games. There seem to be no more Briggs out there, he could place the ball across the face of the goal on large turf fields using the old method. Kinda like impeding a quick restart by standing in front of the ball. If ref allows it to happen, then what can you do?
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Throw Ins
Jan 12, 2019 19:15:49 GMT -6
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Post by gallstar on Jan 12, 2019 19:15:49 GMT -6
What was illegal about the throw ins? Not at this game, but the newish rule allowing for the ball to be brought behind the head from the side, then over the top of the head as in the past is being abused. Too many long ball throw-ins are never brought over the top of the head before release. Instead, they stay on the side of the head it was brought back on and a form of a baseball throw is performed. It happens in club as well as in high school games. There seem to be no more Briggs out there, he could place the ball across the face of the goal on large turf fields using the old method. Kinda like impeding a quick restart by standing in front of the ball. If ref allows it to happen, then what can you do? I agree with everything you wrote. Rules are made to be broken and if the non-compliance of the rules are not called then play on.
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Post by uhscubs1 on Jan 13, 2019 5:47:24 GMT -6
Is it legal to throw in with a hand behind the ball?
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Throw Ins
Jan 13, 2019 9:55:11 GMT -6
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Post by uhscubs1 on Jan 13, 2019 9:55:11 GMT -6
Throw ins for HS are different than all others
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Post by lsufan5454 on Jan 13, 2019 22:04:26 GMT -6
Rule 15 ThrowIn SECTION 1 THROWIN FROM THE TOUCHLINE
ART. 1 . . . A throwin shall be awarded to a team when the ball last touched a member of the opposing team before the entire ball passes beyond the touchline either in the air or on the ground. A goal may not be scored directly from a throwin.
ART. 2. . . The ball shall be thrown in any direction from the point where it crossed the touchline by a player who is facing the field of play and has both feet on the ground on or behind the touchline. The thrower shall use both hands (unless a physical impairment would limit use to one hand) and shall deliver the ball from behind and over the head in one continuous movement. PENALTY: Throwin awarded to the opponent from the spot of the foul.
ART. 3. . . While a throwin is being taken, an opponent shall neither interfere with nor in any way impede the actions of the thrower, and shall stand at least two yards from the point at which the throwin is being taken.
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Post by Bish on Jan 14, 2019 11:32:38 GMT -6
Sounds like a complicated rule that's hard to enforce and based on a lot of discretion.
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Post by uhscubs1 on Jan 14, 2019 12:40:48 GMT -6
To try and clear up the throw in issue and again I hope time2retire or other High School refs can get the NFHS rule posted here to settle it. It actually is not complicated based on my understanding now.
First, NFHS for those that don't know is the National Federation of State High School. I know the acronym does not fit the name but that is what the internet says so it has to be true.
NFHS has their "own" soccer rules or variances of existing rules if you would prefer that explanation, i.e. yellow cards require the offending player to come out of the game until next substitutable moment is reached.
Say all that to say that pretty much all of the University fans (me included) thought just about every St Louis throw was illegal Saturday because the players would slide their right hand (may have been some left handers but did not notice them) behind the ball before bringing the ball forward to throw. This throw is illegal in just about every other level of soccer but High School as I found after investigating it after the game. High School allows a dominate hand but 2 hands still have to touch the ball.
Hopefully some of the High School soccer refs can confirm or correct any of my statements.
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Throw Ins
Jan 14, 2019 13:22:41 GMT -6
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Post by time2retire on Jan 14, 2019 13:22:41 GMT -6
Someone else put the rule in the referee forum
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Post by uhscubs1 on Jan 14, 2019 13:34:40 GMT -6
Is that from NFHS? That looks like the FIFA throw in rule that would say no dominate allowed.
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Post by uhscubs1 on Jan 14, 2019 13:36:58 GMT -6
Rule 15 ThrowIn SECTION 1 THROWIN FROM THE TOUCHLINE ART. 1 . . . A throwin shall be awarded to a team when the ball last touched a member of the opposing team before the entire ball passes beyond the touchline either in the air or on the ground. A goal may not be scored directly from a throwin. ART. 2. . . The ball shall be thrown in any direction from the point where it crossed the touchline by a player who is facing the field of play and has both feet on the ground on or behind the touchline. The thrower shall use both hands (unless a physical impairment would limit use to one hand) and shall deliver the ball from behind and over the head in one continuous movement. PENALTY: Throwin awarded to the opponent from the spot of the foul. ART. 3. . . While a throwin is being taken, an opponent shall neither interfere with nor in any way impede the actions of the thrower, and shall stand at least two yards from the point at which the throwin is being taken. That lines indicates equal force to me. No dominate hand allowed.
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Post by kevin on Jan 14, 2019 15:21:16 GMT -6
Rule 15 ThrowIn SECTION 1 THROWIN FROM THE TOUCHLINE ART. 1 . . . A throwin shall be awarded to a team when the ball last touched a member of the opposing team before the entire ball passes beyond the touchline either in the air or on the ground. A goal may not be scored directly from a throwin. ART. 2. . . The ball shall be thrown in any direction from the point where it crossed the touchline by a player who is facing the field of play and has both feet on the ground on or behind the touchline. The thrower shall use both hands (unless a physical impairment would limit use to one hand) and shall deliver the ball from behind and over the head in one continuous movement. PENALTY: Throwin awarded to the opponent from the spot of the foul. ART. 3. . . While a throwin is being taken, an opponent shall neither interfere with nor in any way impede the actions of the thrower, and shall stand at least two yards from the point at which the throwin is being taken. That lines indicates equal force to me. No dominate hand allowed. It says "use both hands." It doesn't say "use both hands equally." But if a player is using one hand so predominantly that the ball is coming over a shoulder and not over the head, that should be penalized.
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Post by cardsinhand on Jan 14, 2019 15:46:06 GMT -6
Below is what it says for a throw in in IFAB and NFHS. No where in it does it state how the ball gets behind the head or where you put your hands on the ball, only over the head with both hands touching it. Not sure about any "newish rule" regarding throw ins.
IFAB At the moment of delivering the ball, the thrower must:
stand facing the field of play have part of each foot on the touchline or on the ground outside the touchline throw the ball with both hands from behind and over the head from the point where it left the field of play
All opponents must stand at least 2 m (2 yds) from the point at which the throw-in is taken.
The ball is in play when it enters the field of play. If the ball touches the ground before entering, the throw-in is retaken by the same team from the same position. If the throw-in is not taken correctly it is retaken by the opposing team.
If a player, while correctly taking a throw-in, intentionally throws the ball at an opponent in order to play the ball again but neither in a careless nor a reckless manner nor using excessive force, the referee allows play to continue.
The thrower must not touch the ball again until it has touched another player.
NFHS Rule 15 Throw-In SECTION 1 THROW-IN FROM THE TOUCHLINE ART. 1 ... A throw-in shall be awarded to a team when the ball last touched a member of the opposing team before the entire ball passes beyond the touchline either in the air or on the ground. A goal may not be scored directly from a throwin. ART. 2. . . The ball shall be thrown in any direction from the point where it crossed the touchline by a player who is facing the field of play and has both feet on the ground on or behind the touchline. The thrower shall use both hands (unless a physical impairment would limit use to one hand) and shall deliver the ball from behind and over the head in one continuous movement.
PENALTY: Throw-in awarded to the opponent from the spot of the foul.
ART. 3. . . While a throw-in is being taken, an opponent shall neither interfere with nor in any way impede the actions of the thrower, and shall stand at least two yards from the point at which the throw-in is being taken. PENALTY: An official shall administer a caution for unsporting conduct.
Picture of feet placement
ART. 4 ... On a throw-in, the ball is playable when it has left the hands of the thrower and any part of it breaks the plane of the touchline. After the throw-in, the ball may be played by either team. The thrower may not play the ball until it has been touched or played by another player. PENALTY: Indirect free kick awarded to the opponent from the spot of the infraction. ART. 5... If, on the throw-in, the ball fails to enter the field of play before it touches the ground, the ball is awarded to the opponent at the spot of the infraction. (Different from IFAB)
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Post by cardsinhand on Jan 14, 2019 15:50:17 GMT -6
From the other thread. Below is what it says for a throw in in IFAB and NFHS. No where in it does it state how the ball gets behind the head or where you put your hands on the ball, only over the head with both hands touching it. Not sure about any "newish rule" regarding throw ins. IFAB At the moment of delivering the ball, the thrower must: stand facing the field of play have part of each foot on the touchline or on the ground outside the touchline throw the ball with both hands from behind and over the head from the point where it left the field of play All opponents must stand at least 2 m (2 yds) from the point at which the throw-in is taken. The ball is in play when it enters the field of play. If the ball touches the ground before entering, the throw-in is retaken by the same team from the same position. If the throw-in is not taken correctly it is retaken by the opposing team. If a player, while correctly taking a throw-in, intentionally throws the ball at an opponent in order to play the ball again but neither in a careless nor a reckless manner nor using excessive force, the referee allows play to continue. The thrower must not touch the ball again until it has touched another player. NFHS Rule 15 Throw-In SECTION 1 THROW-IN FROM THE TOUCHLINE ART. 1 ... A throw-in shall be awarded to a team when the ball last touched a member of the opposing team before the entire ball passes beyond the touchline either in the air or on the ground. A goal may not be scored directly from a throwin. ART. 2. . . The ball shall be thrown in any direction from the point where it crossed the touchline by a player who is facing the field of play and has both feet on the ground on or behind the touchline. The thrower shall use both hands (unless a physical impairment would limit use to one hand) and shall deliver the ball from behind and over the head in one continuous movement. PENALTY: Throw-in awarded to the opponent from the spot of the foul. ART. 3. . . While a throw-in is being taken, an opponent shall neither interfere with nor in any way impede the actions of the thrower, and shall stand at least two yards from the point at which the throw-in is being taken. PENALTY: An official shall administer a caution for unsporting conduct. Picture of feet placement ART. 4 ... On a throw-in, the ball is playable when it has left the hands of the thrower and any part of it breaks the plane of the touchline. After the throw-in, the ball may be played by either team. The thrower may not play the ball until it has been touched or played by another player. PENALTY: Indirect free kick awarded to the opponent from the spot of the infraction. ART. 5... If, on the throw-in, the ball fails to enter the field of play before it touches the ground, the ball is awarded to the opponent at the spot of the infraction. (Different from IFAB) Read more: laprepsoccer.proboards.com/thread/23101/universty-2-st-louis#ixzz5ccZSW7ic
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Post by uhscubs1 on Jan 14, 2019 16:08:10 GMT -6
That lines indicates equal force to me. No dominate hand allowed. It says "use both hands." It doesn't say "use both hands equally." But if a player is using one hand so predominantly that the ball is coming over a shoulder and not over the head, that should be penalized. FIFA uses the same language. "Use both hands". If a player in FIFA throws the ball with a hand behind the ball and the other hand is used for guidance only that would be allowed?
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Post by uhscubs1 on Jan 14, 2019 16:14:50 GMT -6
Below is what it says for a throw in in IFAB and NFHS. No where in it does it state how the ball gets behind the head or where you put your hands on the ball, only over the head with both hands touching it. Not sure about any "newish rule" regarding throw ins. IFABAt the moment of delivering the ball, the thrower must: stand facing the field of play have part of each foot on the touchline or on the ground outside the touchline throw the ball with both hands from behind and over the head from the point where it left the field of play All opponents must stand at least 2 m (2 yds) from the point at which the throw-in is taken. The ball is in play when it enters the field of play. If the ball touches the ground before entering, the throw-in is retaken by the same team from the same position. If the throw-in is not taken correctly it is retaken by the opposing team. If a player, while correctly taking a throw-in, intentionally throws the ball at an opponent in order to play the ball again but neither in a careless nor a reckless manner nor using excessive force, the referee allows play to continue. The thrower must not touch the ball again until it has touched another player. NFHSRule 15 Throw-In SECTION 1 THROW-IN FROM THE TOUCHLINE ART. 1 ... A throw-in shall be awarded to a team when the ball last touched a member of the opposing team before the entire ball passes beyond the touchline either in the air or on the ground. A goal may not be scored directly from a throwin. ART. 2. . . The ball shall be thrown in any direction from the point where it crossed the touchline by a player who is facing the field of play and has both feet on the ground on or behind the touchline. The thrower shall use both hands (unless a physical impairment would limit use to one hand) and shall deliver the ball from behind and over the head in one continuous movement. PENALTY: Throw-in awarded to the opponent from the spot of the foul. ART. 3. . . While a throw-in is being taken, an opponent shall neither interfere with nor in any way impede the actions of the thrower, and shall stand at least two yards from the point at which the throw-in is being taken. PENALTY: An official shall administer a caution for unsporting conduct. Picture of feet placement ART. 4 ... On a throw-in, the ball is playable when it has left the hands of the thrower and any part of it breaks the plane of the touchline. After the throw-in, the ball may be played by either team. The thrower may not play the ball until it has been touched or played by another player. PENALTY: Indirect free kick awarded to the opponent from the spot of the infraction. ART. 5... If, on the throw-in, the ball fails to enter the field of play before it touches the ground, the ball is awarded to the opponent at the spot of the infraction. (Different from IFAB) That is the same language as FIFA. In a FIFA game can a player do a throw in with one hand behind the ball and the other used for guidance?
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Post by kevin on Jan 14, 2019 17:22:57 GMT -6
It says "use both hands." It doesn't say "use both hands equally." But if a player is using one hand so predominantly that the ball is coming over a shoulder and not over the head, that should be penalized. FIFA uses the same language. "Use both hands". If a player in FIFA throws the ball with a hand behind the ball and the other hand is used for guidance only that would be allowed? Technically, I would say the answer should be yes. However, throwing it in that way makes it more likely that a player isn't delivering the ball from "behind and over the head."
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Post by cardsinhand on Jan 14, 2019 18:02:40 GMT -6
Below is what it says for a throw in in IFAB and NFHS. No where in it does it state how the ball gets behind the head or where you put your hands on the ball, only over the head with both hands touching it. Not sure about any "newish rule" regarding throw ins. IFABAt the moment of delivering the ball, the thrower must: stand facing the field of play have part of each foot on the touchline or on the ground outside the touchline throw the ball with both hands from behind and over the head from the point where it left the field of play All opponents must stand at least 2 m (2 yds) from the point at which the throw-in is taken. The ball is in play when it enters the field of play. If the ball touches the ground before entering, the throw-in is retaken by the same team from the same position. If the throw-in is not taken correctly it is retaken by the opposing team. If a player, while correctly taking a throw-in, intentionally throws the ball at an opponent in order to play the ball again but neither in a careless nor a reckless manner nor using excessive force, the referee allows play to continue. The thrower must not touch the ball again until it has touched another player. NFHSRule 15 Throw-In SECTION 1 THROW-IN FROM THE TOUCHLINE ART. 1 ... A throw-in shall be awarded to a team when the ball last touched a member of the opposing team before the entire ball passes beyond the touchline either in the air or on the ground. A goal may not be scored directly from a throwin. ART. 2. . . The ball shall be thrown in any direction from the point where it crossed the touchline by a player who is facing the field of play and has both feet on the ground on or behind the touchline. The thrower shall use both hands (unless a physical impairment would limit use to one hand) and shall deliver the ball from behind and over the head in one continuous movement. PENALTY: Throw-in awarded to the opponent from the spot of the foul. ART. 3. . . While a throw-in is being taken, an opponent shall neither interfere with nor in any way impede the actions of the thrower, and shall stand at least two yards from the point at which the throw-in is being taken. PENALTY: An official shall administer a caution for unsporting conduct. Picture of feet placement ART. 4 ... On a throw-in, the ball is playable when it has left the hands of the thrower and any part of it breaks the plane of the touchline. After the throw-in, the ball may be played by either team. The thrower may not play the ball until it has been touched or played by another player. PENALTY: Indirect free kick awarded to the opponent from the spot of the infraction. ART. 5... If, on the throw-in, the ball fails to enter the field of play before it touches the ground, the ball is awarded to the opponent at the spot of the infraction. (Different from IFAB) That is the same language as FIFA. In a FIFA game can a player do a throw in with one hand behind the ball and the other used for guidance? As long as the ball goes over the head. Guys, it's a throw in. We just want the ball back in play. Is it really worth this much time?
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Post by uhscubs1 on Jan 14, 2019 20:21:43 GMT -6
Well, if that is the case then why use two hands? Just go ahead and let them throw it in with one which is what is being done when a single hand is behind the ball.
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