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Post by Antimatter on May 18, 2015 5:25:11 GMT -6
The problem with relegating 4 teams from c1 to c2 when there are only four c2 teams playing is that not only do you get the two teams that probably should be relegated but you are also getting the teams that finished 3rd and 4th in c1 LCSL play. So the first weekend in bracket play the four c2 teams only played 1 game against a c2 opponent and 2 against c1 opponents.
The final weekend for c2 u15 featured 3 c1 teams and 1 c2 team. And the final included the 3rd and 4th place teams in the C1 league play.
Unless the LSA is more concerned about the President's cup representation rather than having a true c2 field I am not sure why you drop 2/3 of c1 into the c2 brackets.
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Post by laffysoccermom on May 18, 2015 5:56:34 GMT -6
I have been told that is the goal of C2 state tournament- to put the beat possible team in President's Cup. The frustrating thing is that these two C1 teams will be placed back up in C1 and could repeat this scenario indefinitely. Not their fault but it's just the way it was set up.
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Post by Antimatter on May 18, 2015 6:55:08 GMT -6
I was under the impression that LSA was about Louisiana Soccer and wanted real State Championships at the different competitive levels. Good to know.
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Post by laffysoccermom on May 18, 2015 7:21:00 GMT -6
That's just what I was told. Can't even remember who told me that. It was when LCSL first started and I was told that was the rationale for dropping any comp 1 teams down.
This may not be the case. However, if it is, why not change criteria for how the President's Cup team is chosen. I believe the same person told me that states chose how they select their President's Cup team.
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p_malinich
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Post by p_malinich on May 18, 2015 7:42:15 GMT -6
That's just what I was told. Can't even remember who told me that. It was when LCSL first started and I was told that was the rationale for dropping any comp 1 teams down. This may not be the case. However, if it is, why not change criteria for how the President's Cup team is chosen. I believe the same person told me that states chose how they select their President's Cup team. President's Cup selection has always been very squishy to me.... (and my middle son's team one year was a C1 team that got dropped to C2 state cup, won it, and went to President's Cup). Here's the language from USYS site (Not sure whether LA has < or > 25,000)... Rule 303(3) In State Associations where player registrations are 25,000 or larger during the
immediately preceding seasonal year, teams who participate in the round of 16 or one of the
top 16 teams in a State Cup or State Championships competitions, or participated in the
National League or the most competitive division of the respective regional league, are not
eligible to participate in the National Presidents Cup.
(4) In State Associations where player registration totals less than 25,000 during the
immediately preceding seasonal year, each State Association may designate any team as
their representative to the regional level of the National Presidents Cup.Sooooo.... If you have > 25k, it can't be anyone that competed in the top flight (up to 16 teams) for State Cup. If you have < 25k, you can send anybody. I've never quite understood the logic. And still don't. |
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Post by Antimatter on May 18, 2015 8:03:19 GMT -6
That's just what I was told. Can't even remember who told me that. It was when LCSL first started and I was told that was the rationale for dropping any comp 1 teams down. This may not be the case. However, if it is, why not change criteria for how the President's Cup team is chosen. I believe the same person told me that states chose how they select their President's Cup team. President's Cup selection has always been very squishy to me.. (and my middle son's team one year was a C1 team that got dropped to C2 state cup, won it, and went to President's Cup). Here's the language from USYS site (Not sure whether LA has < or > 25,000). Rule 303(3) In State Associations where player registrations are 25,000 or larger during the
immediately preceding seasonal year, teams who participate in the round of 16 or one of the
top 16 teams in a State Cup or State Championships competitions, or participated in the
National League or the most competitive division of the respective regional league, are not
eligible to participate in the National Presidents Cup.
(4) In State Associations where player registration totals less than 25,000 during the
immediately preceding seasonal year, each State Association may designate any team as
their representative to the regional level of the National Presidents Cup.Sooooo.. If you have > 25k, it can't be anyone that competed in the top flight (up to 16 teams) for State Cup. If you have < 25k, you can send anybody. I've never quite understood the logic. And still don't. They must include rec players because Louisiana has over 25000 according to the numbers on the site. Region III - South Alabama – 15,950 Arkansas – 25,104 Florida – 113,777 Georgia – 78,943 Louisiana – 25,782 Mississippi – 21,516 North Texas – 140,198 North Carolina – 72,999 Oklahoma – 36,222 South Texas – 106,665 South Carolina – 22,372 Tennessee – 49,307 At over 25000, it looks like the team that won would not be eligible to participate. But I could be reading that wrong. |
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p_malinich
Data Expert
www.elevenlions.com
Posts: 4,201
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Post by p_malinich on May 18, 2015 10:22:52 GMT -6
President's Cup selection has always been very squishy to me.. (and my middle son's team one year was a C1 team that got dropped to C2 state cup, won it, and went to President's Cup). Here's the language from USYS site (Not sure whether LA has < or > 25,000). Rule 303(3) In State Associations where player registrations are 25,000 or larger during the
immediately preceding seasonal year, teams who participate in the round of 16 or one of the
top 16 teams in a State Cup or State Championships competitions, or participated in the
National League or the most competitive division of the respective regional league, are not
eligible to participate in the National Presidents Cup.
(4) In State Associations where player registration totals less than 25,000 during the
immediately preceding seasonal year, each State Association may designate any team as
their representative to the regional level of the National Presidents Cup.Sooooo.. If you have > 25k, it can't be anyone that competed in the top flight (up to 16 teams) for State Cup. If you have < 25k, you can send anybody. I've never quite understood the logic. And still don't. They must include rec players because Louisiana has over 25000 according to the numbers on the site. Region III - South Louisiana – 25,782 At over 25000, it looks like the team that won would not be eligible to participate. But I could be reading that wrong. I think it's like GotSoccer (or Soccer-in-College) rankings. The only Championship counted as the State Championship is C1. Therefore, anyone in the C1 tournament (top 16 if that many) would be ineligible. Everyone else should be eligible. |
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Post by WhatDoUNO on May 18, 2015 13:36:42 GMT -6
The problem with relegating 4 teams from c1 to c2 when there are only four c2 teams playing is that not only do you get the two teams that probably should be relegated but you are also getting the teams that finished 3rd and 4th in c1 LCSL play. So the first weekend in bracket play the four c2 teams only played 1 game against a c2 opponent and 2 against c1 opponents. The final weekend for c2 u15 featured 3 c1 teams and 1 c2 team. And the final included the 3rd and 4th place teams in the C1 league play. Unless the LSA is more concerned about the President's cup representation rather than having a true c2 field I am not sure why you drop 2/3 of c1 into the c2 brackets. What I do think is worth mentioning is that the final true C2 team left in the semi-final playoffs, was a team that finish 2nd in C2 bracket play. What happened to Slidell Swat? |
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Post by Antimatter on May 18, 2015 13:51:58 GMT -6
The problem with relegating 4 teams from c1 to c2 when there are only four c2 teams playing is that not only do you get the two teams that probably should be relegated but you are also getting the teams that finished 3rd and 4th in c1 LCSL play. So the first weekend in bracket play the four c2 teams only played 1 game against a c2 opponent and 2 against c1 opponents. The final weekend for c2 u15 featured 3 c1 teams and 1 c2 team. And the final included the 3rd and 4th place teams in the C1 league play. Unless the LSA is more concerned about the President's cup representation rather than having a true c2 field I am not sure why you drop 2/3 of c1 into the c2 brackets. What I do think is worth mentioning is that the final true C2 team left in the semi-final playoffs, was a team that finish 2nd in C2 bracket play. What happened to Slidell Swat? Swat beat the other C2 team and lost to the 2 C1 teams in the preliminary weekend. They were the 5th seed with the four C1 teams dropping down |
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Post by laffysoccermom on May 18, 2015 14:23:12 GMT -6
I want to say the C2 team that was in semis improved so much over the course of the year. Not sure if new players, just hard work or a combination of the two. Well done Chicago Fire White!
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Post by ribod29 on May 18, 2015 15:33:29 GMT -6
The problem with relegating 4 teams from c1 to c2 when there are only four c2 teams playing is that not only do you get the two teams that probably should be relegated but you are also getting the teams that finished 3rd and 4th in c1 LCSL play. So the first weekend in bracket play the four c2 teams only played 1 game against a c2 opponent and 2 against c1 opponents. The final weekend for c2 u15 featured 3 c1 teams and 1 c2 team. And the final included the 3rd and 4th place teams in the C1 league play. Unless the LSA is more concerned about the President's cup representation rather than having a true c2 field I am not sure why you drop 2/3 of c1 into the c2 brackets. What I do think is worth mentioning is that the final true C2 team left in the semi-final playoffs, was a team that finish 2nd in C2 bracket play. What happened to Slidell Swat? |
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Post by ribod29 on May 18, 2015 15:36:36 GMT -6
We played Slidell in both the fall and spring. They were a lot better in the fall. La Fire White seemed to have improved from the fall to the spring season. The results in state cup validate this.
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Post by Antimatter on May 18, 2015 15:53:37 GMT -6
LA Fire White actually lost a player a few weeks prior to state cup and added no players during the season. Their improvement was due to good coaching with buy-in from players who were enjoying themselves.
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Post by WhatDoUNO on May 18, 2015 17:38:26 GMT -6
Quite the compliment! Hope the coach gets to see your message. You must be real close to that team!
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Post by laffysoccermom on May 18, 2015 17:58:19 GMT -6
I didn't see any new players but noticed the improvement.
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Post by WhatDoUNO on May 18, 2015 18:11:33 GMT -6
Lafsoccermom - He clearly said they did NOT pick up any new players.
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Post by laffysoccermom on May 18, 2015 18:27:32 GMT -6
I was agreeing not arguing. I didn't think they had picked up any new ones even when I posted the first time.
I was amazed at how much they improved and I don't mean that they were bad at the beginning so please don't misunderstand. They were a solid comp 2 team in the beginning but in the spring they were a team that could have won Comp 2 and competed with some Comp 1 teams.
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