Should talk about officiating be allowed

[lawdog911]

I've been a high school referee for 8years and a referee for about 13. I've been seeing on the site what seems to be an over pertection of percieved negative comments towards game officials. I can't speak for anyone but myself, but I thinks comments on specific calls or overall preformance by an official is healthy conversation. We run into problems, just as i have with coachs and players this year, when people make the calls and decisions we make personal. Unlike what some think we call the game to the best of our obility, are human do miss calls, yet people take calls we do or don't make personal. Comments about a referee being terrible or no need to be on the field are personal attacks that are not welcomed. Specific comments on judgement calls, just about all calls, help to see what others are seeing weather right or wrong. Plus it makes for good decussion. As a referee I ask that none personal commentary be allowed into decussion, NO NAMES EVER. If you think a pk was wrong ok. If you thought the game got out of control ok. Make it specific. Show positivity or negitivity towards the call made not the person making the call.

[pop]

Well there is an inconsistency amongst refs on calls and cards. Ive seen some tolerate more and some tolerate very little. So when a red card is thrown is it really a red. The consequences are there regardless. Is there anything a coach can do? No. they file the report and wether it is valid or not its filed and the players has to live with it. Also is there a ref association in the state that helps groom refs into a good ref? Perhaps a new ref should be monitored by an experienced ref. then have a game recorded and reviewed so they may improve. I dont know if any assoc. does that. The only avenue a coach has is to scratch or suck it up. Does this allow for improvement? Not really. When a ref makes a mistake and a coach questions or lets the ref know "hey i saw it and u missed it" he may get a card, and that looks bad. So how can one get better without being helped. Some refs and coaches have big ego's and you cant talk to them at all. There should be an avenue for refs to be held accountable for calls, and not just a scratch form.

[fclouisiane]

I think it'd be great to have a forum with informed, constructive observations on referees. The issue is, while there are objective posters on this site, there are also some people who can't shed a bias for their team and some who aren't entirely aware of the rules like referees are- that's what assessors are for.

[goat]

There is a forum it is the referee forum on this board.

[ShreveDad]

Feb 2, 2010 11:19:51 GMT -6 fclouisiane said:

I think it'd be great to have a forum with informed, constructive observations on referees. The issue is, while there are objective posters on this site, there are also some people who can't shed a bias for their team and some who aren't entirely aware of the rules like referees are- that's what assessors are for.

There is a forum on this site for referees. Look down the front page. Lots of good info and any question you have will be answered by someone.

[fclouisiane]

Oh wow, you guys are good. Thanks.

[realitycheck]

accountability is the key....like pop says...if a ref makes a call and it is the wrong one, i.e. a red card and/or a PK, and it directly affects the game in a winning or losing situation, what is the recourse for the official? i lean toward the "nothing happens" side. That is the biggest part of the process that is flawed. In club and such, referees are being assesed to move up the line but this is too few and too often. There are some good ones out there but even still, NO accountability. a system needs to be in place for such problems. That would be a good start....

[lawdog911]

I intended the begining message not to open a referee forum, but to incourage this message board to allow comments on officials calls for EACH game disscussion.

I've done many games this season and have had many coachs and players question calls. This is no problem except that most are not satisified with the answer. Weather you agree with the explination or not, weather the explination was correct or not you asked and it was answered. May times the "questioning the call" is not a question but a statement by the coach or player of their interpritation.

Bottem line I encourage those on this sit to give feed back of the calls made, not on the official his or herself. This is for each new game disscussion opened.

As an official I have admited to missing a call or agreed to dissagree on a call, but at the end of the game it is not nessary for people to go up to officials telling them the suck they have no clue about the game.

IF YOU ALL OUT THERE THINK ITS EASY TO PUT UP WITH YOU, Ichallange to to referee a game, no matter what I evjoy it.

[Boomer]

When do you EVER read about a reff calling a "good" game? I've reff'ed more games than I care to remember. I even reff'ed a couple of "friendlys" this year when the home team either failed to ensure the reffs showed up, or there was confusion.

A reff board is where most discussion belongs, as in baseball. Only if the reff got the call wrong through misinterpretation of the rules ... or if some trait of a specific team was designed to draw a call from the reff ... woulld it be germane to mention here in my opinion, but the discussion should be on the reff board.

There have been only two topics that I think have been legitmate to mention on this board:

(1) Apparently some very few reffs still have a mistaken impression about "offsides," and interpreted it as being literal even if the individual is not involved in the play.

(2) There are certain players on certain teams that are adept at "diving" and have changed games with their skill. That is a discussion that is legitimate.

Furthermore in my too-long experience, complaining about the reff after the game, is like dramatic appealing to the reff during the game... it is almost always looks like you are trying to show him up. It has a negative impact and zero postitve to add.

[grandpasoccer]

i have seen plenty of good ref's call good games, but why would anyone ever say anything when a person does their job they are paid to do?

now when there seems to be an abundance of bad calls they get riled and need to vent.

had a very good ref last night, but the losing team [home team i might add] didn't like him at all. seen the side ref make a lot of bad calls and he corrected them.

ref's have to realize, no one likes them, they are part of the game that are opinions. as long as they can't call both teams wrong at the same time....................................they will be booed. lol

[itsinthegame]

The biggest problem with soccer refs is that one tiny (ha ha) rule re: dissent. I understand the nature of the rule but it can turn soccer refs into prima donnas.
Here is an example- my sons and husband are refs but my husband also coached. During a game he had turn to give instruction to a player that was going to be subbed in and a foul was called while he had turned away so he had no idea what the call was. He asked the ref about the call and the ref told him shut up he was not allowed to question calls. My husband said I am not questioning your call I just need to know WHAT it was since I didn't see it. The ref said you have no right to ask. Husband/coach replies "yes I do" and ref says "no you don't" because that is dissent.
Let's get real here. There had not been any problems in this game or conflict between refs/coaches/players so why couldn't the ref just be human and answer a simple question? My husband has coached other sports as well and soccer refs are the most difficult to deal with because they think they have such an elevated position that the coaches don't deserve their help.
Anyway I believe the BEST refs are invisible. If they are calling well both ways you probably won't be thinking about them. Let the players/coaches determine the outcome and hey refs: it probably won't hurt you to answer simple questions.

[time2retire]

So, what do people think of the Houma association?

If you said "who?"........lol......I understand

[grandpasoccer]

Feb 2, 2010 15:55:13 GMT -6 time2retire said:

So, what do people think of the Houma association?

If you said "who?"........lol......I understand

more football refs than soccer.

allow to much and lose control of the games.

[time2retire]

Feb 2, 2010 23:58:24 GMT -6 grandpasoccer said:

Feb 2, 2010 15:55:13 GMT -6 time2retire said:

So, what do people think of the Houma association?

If you said "who?"........lol......I understand

more football refs than soccer.

allow to much and lose control of the games.

This is a small group of guys who have been together for quite some time. This group's assignor often waits until 24 hours prior to a match before assigning the crew. Many of the younger female officials will not pick up a whistle - even if this means a dual must be worked to have the game played. The association does nothing to promote training and retention.

I am a product of this association. I spent the beginnings of my officiating career not only being taught the wrong way to do things, but given no feedback to let me know the proper way to do them. Fortunately a move away from the area enlightened my knowledge and expanded my capabilities. It took many, many months to relearn the art of officiating a game.

When I did move, I promised to never forget where I came from. I became a referee when I was not pleased with the referees I had. I became an assignor when the post opened itself (in another state). I became an instructor when my abilities and knowledge proved me capable of acting in this capacity. I'd love nothing more than to give the district the referees you guys deserve.

Your association chooses to keep the same guys on the field that I had in high school. Vandebilt saw this and chose the New Orleans association over the Houma crews - what does that say in itself?

[pop]

Only played one game in the Houma area. The center allowed my player to get a clet mark in his chest, but didnt consider it dangerous play...HHHMMMMM ? And while my defense was on a wall for a free kick the play hit my defender in the arm,and was a very strong kick, but it moved his arm [which was at his side ] off the body. End result , a hand ball ...and pk. That was hard to swallow. As a coach i do tend to see the fouls against my team more so than the ones my team commits and I do know my team isnt perfect, but fouls are commited and should be called correctly. I know that one call only ended with one point , but when the players spirit is broken it does have an affect on the game. Players are human and these things do make and break momentum. I have seen bad calls go our way and yes i did enjoy the opponent breaking down and we end up winning. Ill take whatever I can get.. The "W" is nice. But not that night. We got the "L"