Playoff Food for Thought

[barbedad20]

Just wanted to point out a few things.....

There are 10 playoff teams remaining (4-Div I, 2-Div II, and 4 Div III). 9 of the 10 teams were ranked in the final poll and in Div III the 1,2,3 and 5 ranked teams are in the final 4.

Of the 10 remaining playoff teams, Barbe is the only public school still playing.

In Div I, 2 teams from the same district (STM and Barbe-District 3) are still playing. In Div III, 2 teams from the same district (Newman and Sacred Heart-District 9) are still playing.

In Division I, of the 4 remaining teams, only 1 (STM) won a district title.

In Division I, 2 teams are barely over .500 (Barbe and Dominican). Both of these teams played a brutal schedule. Makes you wonder if their coaches know what they are doing by getting these teams ready for the playoffs!!!

Just something to think about.

[Tigertail]

barbedad20 said:

Just wanted to point out a few things.....

... In Div III, 2 teams from the same district (Newman and Sacred Heart-District 9) are still playing...

In fact, only 2 districts are represented in the Semis in Div III, District 3 (St. Louis and CHSNI) and District 9 (Newman and ASH).

[know1important]

Barbedad....on your last point, I think not only did Barbe and Dominican play a tough schedule ,but I believe SSA and STM schedules were tough as well.

[sokerfan]

I know Lafayette 's district was weak this year and that didn't help, but what hurt the most is that the district schedule did not come out when most others received theirs. Non district games that were already scheduled had to be cancelled due to scheduling conflicts with the district games.

To Lafayette's credit they played some good teams, but they were all early in the season. I know the plan was to have games scheduled with good teams just before the playoffs, but it just didn't happen that way.

[phsmom]

Barbedad...with this thread, I have to bring out the dead horse to beat about private vs public. If the private schools played in their own division, think how much it would change the playoff picture. I know this will never be changed, but every year, someone has to mention it, so I figured it might as well be me. Good luck in your next game!

[lcpsoccermom]

I don't understand why the private schools should play in their own division. In NO, everyone goes to private practically because the public schools aren't very good. That's why the private schools have all the talent. This has nothing to do with money. In BR and Laf I don't know if this holds true as much, but in N. LA the public schools are competitive, so you don't have the issue with the private schools being better.

[phsdad]

I know in several states (Ohio and Mississippi) the private schools are on there own division. The reasoning for this is because of recruiting and giving scholarships to the private schools. I don't know if scholarships are offered to athletes in Louisiana to go play for private schools, but if they are then they should be in there own division, due to the fact that they are taking key players from public schools.

[icarustea]

catholic schools do not recruit and are not allowed to recruit. they do not give out scholarships to anyone except for academic (high test scores on the entrance exam) or work-study grants for needy students. so this argument, that they recruit players, at least on the catholic school end, is moot. the only way to get into a parochial school - in new orleans - is that you have to make the grade.

people have to realize that kids in these schools don't go to school for the athletics as their #1 priority. they go there for what school is for - the education. that is why they pay to go there. i guarantee you, parents of good soccer players will not pay $X to a school with a poor academic program that happens to have a good soccer program at the high school level. it just so happens that in new orleans, the kids who play good soccer tend to attend parochial/private schools.

private schools like newman may do it differently. but no, parochial/catholic schools only have academic scholarships and need-based grants.

[barbedad20]

know1important said:

Barbedad....on your last point, I think not only did Barbe and Dominican play a tough schedule ,but I believe SSA and STM schedules were tough as well.

Was not leaving off these teams, I know all 4 teams played a brutal schedule. My point was that the reason Barbe and Dominican have 8 or 9 losses is because of the brutal schedule. Thanks.

[justfurfun01]

Public schools have a large area to pull from and the private schools are pot holes of students. There are definately parents that send their kids to schools based on the sports program, sad but true. Therefore some parents resort to giving addresses in that particular public school system. You would be surprised how much this goes on. But the private schools are much more under the microscope, then public school parents, because of those "few" in the public school system will always look for an excuses why they did not win a achampionship. Would like to know more specifically how students get athletic scholarships at private schools so every one who wants to attend a private school gets that opportunity.

[eurosweeper]

phsmom...regarding private school v. public school divisions.

Public schools should not be required to play private schools. It is unfair. If the public schools choose to play the private schools, and the private schools wins, then the score should be posted as nil-nil. If the public school wins, the final score of the match should be posted. Private schools are not allowed to count nil-nil games but must account for each of their losses to the public schools. Also, the outlandish number of soccer scholarships that the private schools give to their players should be cut so that in addition to tuition and $1,000.00 a month stipends, these individuals are no longer given automobiles, Rolex watches and all expense paid trips to professional soccer matches and Miley Cyrus concerts.

By the way.......THIS IS SARCASM.

But I do have a few questions of my own: 1. Is yours a serious proposal? 2. If you are serious, what is your justification for a private school division vs. a public school division for high school soccer in Louisiana? 3. Do you envision a Private School Division State Champ and a Public School Division State Champ? 4. Will there only be two divisions in the state or a difference number? 5. If there are only two, will Parkway be in the same division as Caddo, Byrd, Barbe, Acadiana, Comeaux, Terrebonne, Dutchtown, Lafayette, BRHS, Fontainebleau, Mandeville, Northshore, etc? 6. How is that competitive for the "smaller" schools vs. the "bigger" schools?

[Wofford Dad f/k/a SJA Dad]

(Catholic schools)... do not give out scholarships to anyone except for academic (high test scores on the entrance exam) or work-study grants for needy students.

[/u][/quote]
Aahhh -- so that's how Catholic, Jesuit, and Rummel (as well as non-Catholic, but private John Curtis) get their athletes for football.

Catholic schools do not recruit and are not allowed to recruit.

Citing the above examples [and hey -- I'm a Catholic fan!], I believe there are a lot of people at the LHSAA annual meetings that would disagree.

I doubt that much recruiting takes place in soccer, because this still is not and probably never will be a soccer state, and thus there are less "public stakes." Maybe there is a bit of soccer recruiting on the boys side -- I simply do not know.

The reason soccer is probably more and better developed within the private schools is pure economics. A family that can afford to send their child to Newman can obviously afford to put him or her in club ball, as well as ODP.

The reason this state will never break up playoffs between public and private schools is because a.) doubling your playoffs will double your budget, and there isn't enough money [you could address this by eliminating within each population based divisions, but will the smaller schools go for that? I bet Newman would!! I bet Vandy would!!]; and b.) doing so would significantly dilute the quality of both playoff formats. I have a sneaky suspicion that Barbe, Laffy, Mandy, and Fonty want to be able to compete against Mt. Carmel, Dominican, SSA, and STM -- and vice versa.

My two cents.

[phsmom]

I am not worried about not winning a championship. Our girl's played to the best of their ability and we are very proud of them for their accomplishment. But when you look at the end of the bracket in almost every instance and there sits a private school, it does make you wonder what the bracket would look like with only public schools. You say we have a large area to pull from, we do not. You must live within a certain geographic area to attend each public school. If my next door neighbor sends their child, who happens to be a great soccer player, to a private school, then our public school has lost a player of value. If nine sets of parents from all over whichever city all decide to send their great soccer player children to that same private school, then the private school program excels and the public schools continue to build the best program they can with the children who attend that school. It is not a level playing field. As I said before, it is not something that will ever change, but because the private schools are always in the finals, it is something that will always be discussed.
As to the idea that private schools do not offer scholarships to athletes to attend their school, we know for a fact it happens, of course, it is not an athletic scholarship, but it is an offer of tuition none the less and there are some great players in all sports attending private schools with a lot of tuition help.

[icarustea]

zidanezshrink said:

(Catholic schools)... do not give out scholarships to anyone except for academic (high test scores on the entrance exam) or work-study grants for needy students.

[/u][/quote]
Aahhh -- so that's how Catholic, Jesuit, and Rummel (as well as non-Catholic, but private John Curtis) get their athletes for football.

Catholic schools do not recruit and are not allowed to recruit.

Citing the above examples [and hey -- I'm a Catholic fan!], I believe there are a lot of people at the LHSAA annual meetings that would disagree.

I doubt that much recruiting takes place in soccer, because this still is not and probably never will be a soccer state, and thus there are less "public stakes." Maybe there is a bit of soccer recruiting on the boys side -- I simply do not know.

The reason soccer is probably more and better developed within the private schools is pure economics. A family that can afford to send their child to Newman can obviously afford to put him or her in club ball, as well as ODP.

The reason this state will never break up playoffs between public and private schools is because a.) doubling your playoffs will double your budget, and there isn't enough money [you could address this by eliminating within each population based divisions, but will the smaller schools go for that? I bet Newman would!! I bet Vandy would!!]; and b.) doing so would significantly dilute the quality of both playoff formats. I have a sneaky suspicion that Barbe, Laffy, Mandy, and Fonty want to be able to compete against Mt. Carmel, Dominican, SSA, and STM -- and vice versa.

My two cents.

[/quote]

That was my point really. It's the economics and the way the school education works in some areas of the state. I am a Dominican alum and I can tell you ten years ago when I attended, the recruiting went like this: "How come you're going to Dominican? MCA's won state last year, why won't you play there?" The financial offers that recruitment implies isn't there.

For the boys schools, I figured it was the same. Jesuit, Rummel, etc doesn't win football past districts on a consistent basis. If they are "recruiting" than ...that's a waste of money haha.

I am in Virginia now and here the private schools play in an independent league. It's crazy because my husband coaches for St. Gertrude and he has to travel close to an hour and 45 minutes for a DISTRICT game. Also the private schools here don't give much competition. It's meaningless. St. Gertrude's team would give as much competition to any of the public schools around the area. They are trying to merge it in a few years to alleviate the travel expense. The reason being? Everyone deserves the chance to play with and against the best. Isn't that what competition is about?

[eurosweeper]

What a change...a good thread with intellectually based discussion. My hats off to all.

To phsmom...you get an "exalt" from me. It's nice to not be attacked for offering my observation/opinion...albeit sarcastic. Thank you.

[cgcsu]

barbedad20 said:

Just wanted to point out a few things.....

In Division I, 2 teams are barely over .500 (Barbe and Dominican). Both of these teams played a brutal schedule. Makes you wonder if their coaches know what they are doing by getting these teams ready for the playoffs!!!

Of course, a good photographer never hurts


If public and private get divided, what do you do about Caddo, Byrd, BRHS, Lafayette, the magnet schools. Aren't these realistically "public private" schools. My school may never win a state championship, but I want to go down playing against the best. This isn't 5 year old rec. ball. Life is tough. Harvard grads generally do better in the job market than the GED kids. Don't water down the state championships with a category for everyone.

[sokerfan]

In the Lafayette area because of the rezoning and the busing of whites to predominately black high schools, the private schools have grown tremendously. I grew up just north of I-10 and all students went to Carencro High, and now they are zoning white students to Northside high. Classmates of mine which built homes in the country next to their parents are now sending their kids to Teurlings and/or STM. Therefore Carencro is hurting when it comes to athletics. This has helped no one but the private schools. You can fell how you want but I know of a person that is in the NBA right now that WAS given a "work program" not schlorship to STM from Carencro and did absolutely NO WORK towards the program. I went to school with his father and his mother did not work any of the concessions for the basketball games because she told them I came to watch my son play.

As far as anything offered to soccer players I do not believe this is happening, but in other sports, definitely. I just would like an equal playing field and I know the New Orleans area may be different than other areas. Just imagine this, John Curtis playing the likes of Evangel, STM, Catholic of BR, Jesuit etc., some interesting football huh? I don't know the answer but in some sports it just seems not to be equal playing fields.

I love it... every year this topic comes up. Private (Catholic) schools do recruit. Seen it with my own eyes and heard it with my own ears. I called out the school's administrator on the spot and I asked "I thought you did not recruit?" Answer...

It's called "grants to needy students".

who just so happen to run like a deer, has the moves of Pele', or whatever a particular team needs. Go out and give a grant to a kid who lives in a 30% below median income household of 10, single parent household and has the athletic skills of Pee Wee Herman and the mind to go with it, then I'll be impressed.

If it was about ONLY education, the New Orleans kids would be at Ben Franklin, BR @ BRHS, Shevreport at Caddo Magnet and Lafayette @ Lafayette High in the gifted programs.

Call it what you want, it happens.

And we already have water down playoffs, we do not need to split. Probably really need only one or two divisions actually.

Now everyone calm down before your Wheaties get soggy and play soccer, period. And to SJA Dad, I gave u a +1 Karama to help u out... I agree 95% with u, just need to give BRHS gifted program some credit.

[eurosweeper]

Intellectually based discussion? It was for a while.

I don't know why I thought on laprepsoccer.com we'd discuss high soccer and not private school football and basketball recruiting. Silly me.

[justfurfun01]

I believe economics is a major factor in Soccer, most kids playing soccer at the highest club level have paid (literally) and just happen to be at private schools. In New Orleans, the girls are spread out among Newman, Dominican, Sacred Heart and Mt. Carmel. I just don't know any at the public Schools. On the Northshore it is different, Mandeville and Fontainebleau are right in there with SSA, in soccer and volleyball, but that is the area they are in. Ponchatoula may not have a strong girls soccer team but they are a beast in basketball. It has nothing to do with pulling kids into play sports, it is just where the chips fall. These kids who travel extensively with soccer, do it for the competition. Sometimes they play in tournaments that may be way out of their league, but nice to know where they stand and what they need to do to reach that level. I can promise you Barb probably loves playing a Dominican or a Sacred Heart, or even an SSA. Why take that level of competition out of the Playoffs, just to make it an easier path to reach the Championship. The Dominican/ Fontainebleau game could have gone either way, but it didn't. You would have to say Dominican is now playing at the top of their game. Losing in a shootout is not a shutout. It just made the playoffs that much more exciting.