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Post by coachray40 on Dec 31, 2014 11:05:05 GMT -6
On Dec 20, Nola.com published an article outlining the preliminary enrollment #s provided to LHSAA for reclassification for the 2015-16, 2016-17 school years. These numbers, while currently unofficial, are reasonably close enough to start a discussion on their impact toward reclassification and the 4 Division soccer proposition on the table for the LHSAA Winter meetings to be held in January. There was a pdf file that was attached to the article that I was able to down load but that I am having trouble uploading to LAprep. Email (raylinton@cox.net) or PM me if you want that file and I'll send it to you.
in the meantime, I transferred all of the enrollment info to an Excell spreadsheet, eliminating from the list the schools that currently dont have a soccer program listed with LHSAA for participation, or who may have/had one recently but dont look to be playing this year (Redemptorist who is closing, Fisher, Sam Houston), while including to that list some schools that are playing, albeit limited or non District (Independence, Grant, Pine, Franklinton, JS Clark). I then used this info to come up with a PROJECTED break down of next years Divisions, both in the 3- and 4-Division formats. I then went a step further, PROJECTING the hypothetical districts using nothing more than geography. In some instances those ditrict look starnge, but I will explain my rationale for them later.
As you can see i have entirely too much time on my hands!
First, projected under the 3 Divisional Format:
DI 1 Lafayette 2455 2 Jesuit 2374 3 Byrd 2231 4 Denham Springs 2218 5 Catholic-BR 2198 6 West Monroe 2151 7 Dutchtown 2126 8 Sulphur 2003 9 Barbe 1967 10 Ehret 1963 11 Comeaux 1936 12 St Amant 1908 13 Airline 1830 14 Mandeville 1827 15 East Ascension 1825 16 Brother Martin 1812 17 New Iberia 1794 18 Acadiana 1787 19 Ponchatoula 1724 20 Chalmette 1709 21 Fontainebleau 1706 22 Zachary 1577 23 Walker 1568 24 Slidell 1556 25 Covington 1547 26 Northshore 1544 27 Hahnville 1530 28 Baton Rouge 1477 29 Destrehan 1457 30 HL Bourgeois 1441 31 Bonnabel 1433 32 Pineville 1432 33 Natchitoches Central 1422 34 St Pauls 1420 35 Hammond 1418 36 Higgins 1400 37 Southwood 1398 38 McKinley 1374 39 Grace King 1359 40 Thibodaux 1354 41 West Jefferson 1345 42 East St John 1340 43 Central Lafourche 1337 44 Captain Shreve 1324 45 Landry Walker 1316 46 Alexandria 1314 47 Central-BR 1311 48 Live Oak 1283 49 Parkway 1282 50 Ouachita Parish 1280 51 Terrebonne 1257 52 Ruston 1251 53 Broadmoor 1250 54 Archbishop Rummel 1238 55 Haughton 1228 56 Holy Cross 1222 57 East Jefferson 1159
DII 58 Woodlawn-BR 1156 59 South Lafourche 1146 60 West Ouachita 1138 61 Caddo Magnet 1122 62 Carencro 1090 63 Westgate 1086 64 St Thomas More 1076 65 Tara 1065 66 Lakeshore 1052 67 Belaire 1048 68 South Terrebonne 1016 69 Salmen 978 70 Neville 973 71 Tioga 972 72 Ellender 969 73 Helen Cox 962 74 Northwood 955 75 Riverdale 945 76 Ben Franklin 897 77 Beau Chene 896 78 Benton 887 79 Belle Chasse 884 80 Bastrop 857 81 Minden 846 82 Franklinton 829 83 Opelousas 813 84 Deridder 805 85 Plaquemine 801 86 Morgan City 800 87 Archbishop Shaw 787 88 Leesville 782 89 Grant 747 90 Teurlings 735 91 St Michaels 726 92 Pearl River 707 93 Vandebilt 696 94 Abbeville 672 95 Bossier 661 96 North Desoto 653
DIII 97 Lutcher 628 98 ED White 622 99 West Feliciana 601 100 North Vermillion 591 101 Buckeye 591 102 Peabody 575 103 St Louis 570 104 Bolton 561 105 Erath 555 106 NO Military and Maritime 539 107 International HS of NO 536 108 Kaplan 531 109 Lusher Charter 505 110 Parkview Baptist 493 111 University 448 112 Independence 441 113 De le Salle 440 114 JS Clark 432 115 Loyola 432 116 Notre Dame 424 117 Episcopal 406 118 Thomas Jefferson 400 119 Archbishop Hannan 398 120 St Charles 391 121 Catholic -NI 390 122 Haynes Academy 379 123 Evangel Christian 366 124 Pine 364 125 Menard 351 126 Lee Magnet 350 127 St Thomas Aquinas 343 128 North Caddo 341 129 Red River 335 130 Isadore Newman 332 131 David Thibodaux 314 132 Pope John Paul II 293 133 Riverside Academy 292 134 Northlake Christian 279 135 Dunham 277 136 Ouachita Christian 268 137 Rapides 268 138 Opelousas Catholic 262 139 Metairie Park Country Day 241 140 Calvary Baptist 241 141 Christian Life 239 142 Runnels 235 143 Westminster Christian 228 144 Lafayette Christian 210 145 Catholic PC 202 146 Ascension Episcopal 201 147 St Frederick 194 148 St Martins 181 149 Patrick Taylor 180 150 Episcopal of Acadiana 176 151 Glenmora 169 152 Houma Christian 167 153 Grace Christian 144 154 Covenant Christian 139 155 Ascension Christian 132 156 Lutheran 103
Some major changes as Carencro, Woodlawn, and possibly Caddo move down into D2, while East Jefferson and Broadmoor move up. Other Notables dropping down into DIII are Lutcher and Bolton. nothing really over the top here other than the typical changes that come every two years
Now comes the fun--the projected breakdown under the 4 Divisional Format(based on the premise of 4 "equal #" divisions):
D1 1 Lafayette 2455 2 Jesuit 2374 3 Byrd 2231 4 Denham Springs 2218 5 Catholic-BR 2198 6 West Monroe 2151 7 Dutchtown 2126 8 Sulphur 2003 9 Barbe 1967 10 Ehret 1963 11 Comeaux 1936 12 St Amant 1908 13 Airline 1830 14 Mandeville 1827 15 East Ascension 1825 16 Brother Martin 1812 17 New Iberia 1794 18 Acadiana 1787 19 Ponchatoula 1724 20 Chalmette 1709 21 Fontainebleau 1706 22 Zachary 1577 23 Walker 1568 24 Slidell 1556 25 Covington 1547 26 Northshore 1544 27 Hahnville 1530 28 Baton Rouge 1477 29 Destrehan 1457 30 HL Bourgeois 1441 31 Bonnabel 1433 32 Pineville 1432 33 Natchitoches Central 1422 34 St Pauls 1420 35 Hammond 1418 36 Higgins 1400 37 Southwood 1398 38 McKinley 1374 39 Grace King 1359
DII 40 Thibodaux 1354 41 West Jefferson 1345 42 East St John 1340 43 Central Lafourche 1337 44 Captain Shreve 1324 45 Landry Walker 1316 46 Alexandria 1314 47 Central-BR 1311 48 Live Oak 1283 49 Parkway 1282 50 Ouachita Parish 1280 51 Terrebonne 1257 52 Ruston 1251 53 Broadmoor 1250 54 Archbishop Rummel 1238 55 Haughton 1228 56 Holy Cross 1222 57 East Jefferson 1159 58 Woodlawn-BR 1156 59 South Lafourche 1146 60 West Ouachita 1138 61 Caddo Magnet 1122 62 Carencro 1090 63 Westgate 1086 64 St Thomas More 1076 65 Tara 1065 66 Lakeshore 1052 67 Belaire 1048 68 South Terrebonne 1016 69 Salmen 978 70 Neville 973 71 Tioga 972 72 Ellender 969 73 Helen Cox 962 74 Northwood 955 75 Riverdale 945 76 Ben Franklin 897 77 Beau Chene 896 78 Benton 887
DIII 79 Belle Chasse 884 80 Bastrop 857 81 Minden 846 82 Franklinton 829 83 Opelousas 813 84 Deridder 805 85 Plaquemine 801 86 Morgan City 800 87 Archbishop Shaw 787 88 Leesville 782 89 Grant 747 90 Teurlings 735 91 St Michaels 726 92 Pearl River 707 93 Vandebilt 696 94 Abbeville 672 95 Bossier 661 96 North Desoto 653 97 Lutcher 628 98 ED White 622 99 West Feliciana 601 100 North Vermillion 591 101 Buckeye 591 102 Peabody 575 103 St Louis 570 104 Bolton 561 105 Erath 555 106 NO Military and Maritime 539 107 International HS of NO 536 108 Kaplan 531 109 Lusher Charter 505 110 Parkview Baptist 493 111 University 448 112 Independence 441 113 De le Salle 440 114 JS Clark 432 115 Loyola 432 116 Notre Dame 424 117 Episcopal 406
D IV 118 Thomas Jefferson 400 119 Archbishop Hannan 398 120 St Charles 391 121 Catholic -NI 390 122 Haynes Academy 379 123 Evangel Christian 366 124 Pine 364 125 Menard 351 126 Lee Magnet 350 127 St Thomas Aquinas 343 128 North Caddo 341 129 Red River 335 130 Isadore Newman 332 131 David Thibodaux 314 132 Pope John Paul II 293 133 Riverside Academy 292 134 Northlake Christian 279 135 Dunham 277 136 Ouachita Christian 268 137 Rapides 268 138 Opelousas Catholic 262 139 Metairie Park Country Day 241 140 Calvary Baptist 241 141 Christian Life 239 142 Runnels 235 143 Westminster Christian 228 144 Lafayette Christian 210 145 Catholic PC 202 146 Ascension Episcopal 201 147 St Frederick 194 148 St Martins 181 149 Patrick Taylor 180 150 Episcopal of Acadiana 176 151 Glenmora 169 152 Houma Christian 167 153 Grace Christian 144 154 Covenant Christian 139 155 Ascension Christian 132 156 Lutheran 103
This makes for a much different landscape! Traditional DI teams such as Rummel, Shreve, Caddo, Central lafourche, Terrebonne, Live Oak and Central-BR get moved into the same division along with powerhouse Beau Chene and Ben Franklin, and St Thomas More
DIII now would have University, Parkview, St Louis, Lutcher, St Mikes, Vandebilt, Bolton, ED White, and Teurlings in the same division.
D IV would now be more consistent with school size, with the enrollment difference between smallest and largest being only 300, where the current 3 Divisional format has it at over 500.
Very interesting stuff. Again there are variables to this projection--teams like Shaw, Rummel, Caddo all traditionally petitioning to play up, the impact of the 32 team "6A" proposition also on the table, and schools either fielding or not feilding teams next year.
We can get the ball rolling for discussion right now, and I'll post my projected districts in a little while
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Post by JB on Dec 31, 2014 13:44:22 GMT -6
This goes out the Styxfollowers....Too Much time on my hands!
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jk52
All-District
Posts: 216
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Post by jk52 on Dec 31, 2014 14:18:55 GMT -6
There are less girls' teams than boys' teams. Will the girls be split evenly based on their numbers or will they be assigned divisions and districts based on the boys' divisions as per Ray's splits, with the all girls' schools slotting in where their numbers are as is currently done in other sports?
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Post by beauchenecoach on Dec 31, 2014 14:34:27 GMT -6
Your 3 division is way off... But I was gonna do this over the weekend with the official Lhsaa numbers... But I am 100% behind 4 division proposal that is on table for January and before reclass for next year so it could be in effect for next year.
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Post by beauchenecoach on Dec 31, 2014 14:35:17 GMT -6
There are less girls' teams than boys' teams. Will the girls be split evenly based on their numbers or will they be assigned divisions and districts based on the boys' divisions as per Ray's splits, with the all girls' schools slotting in where their numbers are as is currently done in other sports? Girls only teams get placed into the number range they fall after splitting the boys teams. They aren't counted as a separate school.
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warrior16
Data Expert
Michael Stein - Volunteer Assitant
Posts: 2,169
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Post by warrior16 on Dec 31, 2014 14:42:36 GMT -6
I could swear St. Michael has way more than 726 students, if total enrollment is what that number represents. Our enrollment was close to 900 when I graduated last year, and this past freshman class alone had nearly 300 kids. With the way Southeast BR is growing at an incredible rate, we could easily become a 5A school in the next 10 years if we wanted to, but I believe the plan is to remain a 4A school.
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Post by beauchenecoach on Dec 31, 2014 15:00:15 GMT -6
I would also expect a few "new D2" schools to play up like Rummel and holy cross into the catholic league. And few others here and there may play up. Caddo always plays up, but with Capt Shreve (if correct as I had them in D1 still but I hurried though it as I had 41 or 42 as my numbers per division) and Parkway being in D2, maybe they wouldn't. If BC was to be DIII as we are on border according to my calculations, we will definitely play up to D2.
This proposal needs to pass for the growth of soccers future. More smaller schools will join. It helped in volleyball also as this is the method they used. 24 team playoffs and we actually (despite habing 4 divisions instead of 5) would have more teams per division than volleyball does. So there is precedent and this will even things out and work better.
BTW... For you who want to say well let's give everyone a trophy.... This will not add anymore playoff teams... Do the math (24x4=96, 32,32,32= 96)... Just one more title game for each gender
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Post by beauchenecoach on Dec 31, 2014 15:07:35 GMT -6
I could swear St. Michael has way more than 726 students, if total enrollment is what that number represents. Our enrollment was close to 900 when I graduated last year, and this past freshman class alone had nearly 300 kids. With the way Southeast BR is growing at an incredible rate, we could easily become a 5A school in the next 10 years if we wanted to, but I believe the plan is to remain a 4A school. Those are your official numbers... 726.
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Post by beauchenecoach on Dec 31, 2014 15:11:09 GMT -6
Btw Ray, thanks for the work. I was going to do this over the weekend... Just would like to fix that 3 equal Division one. Did you do it based on current classification format (it appears so to me)? Remember, at the very least, of the 4 equal division proposal doesn't pass in January, we will do 3 equal divisions with 32 team playoffs as voted in 2 years ago, but too late for that reclass. So nothing is based on classification of football and major sports anymore no matter if 4 division proposal passes or not. So a 3 division formt would look different than the one posted above. But I love that 4 division one and I would think the growth it could help influence at the lower levels could lead to five divisions one day within the next 6-10 years.
im gonna re look at your 4 as I could swear it had 40 or 42 per division counting. A lot of new schools yiu may not be counting... Plus teams like a Norte dame that is back playing JV schedule as I understand. I had capt Shreve in DI on my initial, but very unofficial count. Will relook and get some calls made to see which schools,are in and out next year for varsity... And try to get this exact as possible. But this is very close to what I had, I just had a few more per division so there are some teams I counted that aren't in here. (st Martinville adding soccer... Possibly Cecilia, St John Berchman, etc...). Gonna be very interesting! I love the 4 division for at(didn't I say that a LOT already?) and everyone I talk to does as well. This will pass.
edit.... after re looking at my official numbers... You have wrong numbers for a few teams ahead of Capt Shreve so that's where my difference comes in....east St John and Landry Walker at 1316, central Lafourche at 1297, west Jeff at 1253
so that's why I have Capt Shreve in the top 40 and in Div I and that's huge cause I think it leads to chain effect of Caddo moving up and maybe other Shreveport bossier area teams doing it as well.
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Post by SFC Retired on Dec 31, 2014 15:45:36 GMT -6
Where's Sacred Heart G.C.?
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Post by coachray40 on Dec 31, 2014 16:09:20 GMT -6
Let me clarify a couple things. Im using a PDF that accompanied Nola.coms article, so the #s listed on my earlier post come from that. I can forward that to anyone interested. Chad--Im assuming you have a different set of enrollment #s from elsewhere--not doubting you, just curious on how we are getting different info. I would be willing to bet you probably have more correct info than me....just want to see where we can clarify a few of these differences so folks reading this dont go grapenuts because we are working from different data.
My three divisional projection was again based on Aclass breaks provided by Nola.com's pdf spread sheet. I simply used the current reclass structure, with 5A being DI, 4A being DII, and 3A down being DIII. I didnt take into consideration that there was a 3 equal class proposal, so thats where we have differences. Im operating off the exisiting system.
I'll clarify some additions/subtractions I had to the working list--I used the existing teams that are playing a Varsity schedule this year to vett my list based off LHSAA's website. I tried to check all those that I wasnt sure of. I included Independence, Grant, Franklinton, and JS CLark. Clark only has two games scheduled, so I wasnt really sure about them, but I figured that would work itself out. I didnt include Fisher--who has no schedule--or Sam Houston. You might know something different about Notre Dame, as they currently have a 12 game LHSAA schedule, have played 2 games already, and seem to be competing for district honors. I left Redemptorist out due to its imminent closing. Who else is out there that I might have either missed or included erroneously? I came up with 155 teams, or three divisions of 39 and one division of 38. I then worked from the top down.
Id like to clarify these questions so we get a more accurate list thats closer to being reliable
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Post by coachray40 on Dec 31, 2014 16:10:14 GMT -6
Oh, and I did not include any girls info....girls side will have to do their own work
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Post by coachray40 on Dec 31, 2014 16:25:54 GMT -6
Chad--2 other items that are different on my list. On my list I have a column for "9th grade transitional" students, which are being included into the overall Total enrollment of each school. I'd say that 2/3 of the schools on this list have these types of students--can you clarify what that exactly means? That is where you and i are getting our discrepancies. Also, the numbers on my list only include 9th grade and above, so current enrollment here doent include eligible 7th and 8th graders.
Help me out with the transitional students thing.
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Post by coachray40 on Dec 31, 2014 16:31:20 GMT -6
OK--found it:
1.10.17 Transitional 9th Grade Student: A transitional 9th grade student shall be defined as a student who does not meet the standard and does not meet the requirements for other state waivers for promotion to the 9th grade due failure to pass the required sections of a statewide or school system mandated examination required for promotion to the 9th grade may be placed in the transitional 9th grade option by the School Building Level Committee of the LEA. To be eligible for athletic participation a transitional 9th grade student shall be enrolled in and attends an LHSAA school under the jurisdiction of a member school principal. The student shall be taking a full class schedule that includes at least one high school subject or Carnegie unit(s) and a remedial subject(s) as required which fulfils the scholastic requirements for interscholastic participation for the first semester of the school year. 1. A transitional 9th grade student shall begin their ensuing eight consecutive semesters of eligibility. 2. The results of a statewide or school system mandated examination for promotion to the 9th grade shall not be used to determine a student’s scholastic eligibility for the first semester of a school year. In this context, the promotion examination is considered to be in addition to the other requirements setforth in the school’s/school system’s pupil progression program. 3. When a student described in this rule takes enough Carnegie unit subjects to meet the basic requirements of the LHSAA’s Scholastic Rule, a student’s scholastic eligibility shall be determined as follows: a. To be scholastically eligible for the second semester of the school year, a student shall pass at least six (6) subjects, including remedial subjects, from the first semester of the school year. b. To be scholastically eligible for the first semester of the next school year, a student shall have earned at least six (6) units from the previous year, which shall be listed on the student’s transcript and shall have earned at least a “C” average as determined by the Local Education Authority when considering all “graded” subjects. 4. Students placed in transitional 9th grade shall not be included in the high school graduation cohort during their first year on the high school campus but they are still eligible to graduate in four years. Any student that has been classified as a 9th grade transitional student and does not graduate in four years shall not be eligible for athletic participation in his/her fifth year of high school. A transitional 9th grade student shall also not be eligible for hardship consideration during his/her fifth year of high school.
This looks to me to be a student who either was a social promotion, or who did not pass the 8th grade exit exam for promotion into 9th grade. It also looks like, if I am reading this correctly, these students are considered eligible provided they take the proper course, can still graduate in four years, but are not counted on the schools enrollment records in their first year. Now that I understand this, I cant say that I am altogether onboard with this idea. Think it doesnt matter? Bonnabel has 97 of these kids, Pineville 69, Grace King 94, West Jefferson 92, Broadmoor 71, Tioga 59, Bolton 83(%15 of their enrollment according to my #'s). These kids can play starting midway through the soccer season, just didnt pass a test, and could end end up being honor students and graduate at the same time as any other incoming freshman, but arent counted in enrollment #'s. Really?
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jk52
All-District
Posts: 216
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Post by jk52 on Dec 31, 2014 17:18:44 GMT -6
To clarify my earlier question: Will it be possible for a coed school to have their boys' team and their girls' team end up in different divisions?
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Post by historian on Dec 31, 2014 17:33:17 GMT -6
if four divisions pass, how many districts would be in each division?
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Post by loJic on Dec 31, 2014 17:38:10 GMT -6
if four divisions pass, how many districts would be in each division? 65
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Post by historian on Dec 31, 2014 17:43:20 GMT -6
if four divisions pass, how many districts would be in each division? 65 Assuming a typo…would there be 65 total across all divisions? how many in d1?
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Post by loJic on Dec 31, 2014 18:14:02 GMT -6
65 districts. 2-3 teams each district. Going to have 23 championships as well. Coke and a trophy. Hi five!
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Post by loJic on Dec 31, 2014 18:18:24 GMT -6
I'm obviously goofin. Not sure if they'll stack districts or make them smaller. I have ran many possibilities as they all look meh. Lets just do away with divisions and districts and have teams play 18 games and at the end have the world cup octopus pick the teams it feels should be in the playoffs. bah humbug silly enrollment mumbo jumbo. Good luck Southwood, should be tons of fun.
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